Originally Posted by
NoCheerios
Oracle, you've clearly never played against a competent Fizz as an ap caster. He completely shuts them down. Generally, on characters like Brand or Xerath where that's just their bread and butter. But y'know what? They can't full rotation him. Any good Fizz can avoid a Xerath stun and/or ulti/poke, Lux laser, Leblanc nuke, Veigar ult, Brand ult AND harass, you name it.
You clearly never heard, but I play a competent Fizz. I know all the techniques that are commonly used by him, and I know EXACTLY how to counter them.
His E has a cd around 10 seconds early game ONLY IF PRIORITIZED, meaning it's probably actually closer to 20 since the average player maxes his W first, and it's his primary, and most effective, way of avoiding damage. Therefore, only the most stupid fizzes will use his E for an initiation. Therefore, as a melee, he has only two viable options to initiate a poke, Q and R. R only happens at level 6, so it's negligible at this point, though I will touch on it later. Q has a range that is smaller than ALMOST EVERY AP mid's poke. Already, by this logic, should you attempt to even get close to the enemy, he will just poke and back off, effectively wasting your time and health.
But what about the fact most AP mid's have skillshot pokes? This slight increase in difficulty to poke (going to assume that they aren't amazing at their shot, but at least hitting maybe 50% of the time on average, depending on the scenario upwards of 70-90% and down to about 0-30%) is offset by the fact most of them have CC added to that skillshot. And having played fizz quite often, I know perfectly well that fizz is a very nice squishy target when he get's stunned/silenced/snared/rooted/taunted. Also take into consideration, that you are basically dashing DIRECTLY IN A STRAIGHT LINE TOWARDS AN ENEMY CHAMPION when you want to poke. Now take into consideration that common AP mids, such as Ahri, Morgana, Brand, Kennen, and so on, tend to have good CC skillshots. And you are dashing right at them. In a straight line. With nothing to intercept the shot. Good job, you're now snared/stunned/rooted/taunted etc. etc. right in front of an enemy champion that can now unleash hell on you.
But what about people that don't have such CC? Cass doesn't have hard CC until her ult for example, yet she's a strong mid pick. Surely, that means you should have an easy time against her right? WRONG. Congratulations, you've dashed her, she has an easy poison hit, and now you're eating twin fangs in a mad dash back to your turret because she outdamages you by far. Heimerdinger? Good job, you're eating turret shots and having microrockets shoved into every possible orifice. Malzahar? Good job, you're now eating malefic visions, and voidling hits. Kass, LB, even fucking Soraka. CONGRATUALTIONS, SILENCED SO YOU CAN'T E OUT AND THEY'RE RELEASING HELL ON YOU.
But your ult can initiate right? Do I really need to refute this, because there's a very logical, and OBVIOUS, reason that your ult isn't suddenly going to make you win your lane. Reason being, your opponent will have an ult by this time too :o who would have thought of that? You've ulted morgana? Lul gtfo bitch, ulted as well, eat tormented soil while I take absolutely no CC because I had black shield. Ulted kennen? Good job, lightning is everywhere and you're smack dab next to him. Ulted brand? This one isn't as obvious, but combined with the argument about how you need to close the gap to start doing damage, he'll just sear you to stun, then unleash hell when he lands back on the ground, assuming of course you even managed to hit him with your ult.
tl;dr: using the argument that I'm not considering the player to be a competent fizz doesn't override the fact that a competent player using any other AP mid has a significant advantage due to range, poking ability, and actual CC.
Last edited by Oracle; Feb 22, 2012 at 10:29 PM.