Originally Posted by MintCat
Could you expand on the first sentence please. It doesn't make a lot of sense.
"He stated on opinion, and he's entitled to have that opinion" yes, I agree. that's basically the point I was making.
"but his opinion does not protect him from job repercussions if by stating or acting on that opinion inhibits his job" - are you against free speech? is it fine to be dumped off a programme because you're giving an honest opinion?
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the thread's title also bothers me. an opinion cannot be incorrect if it's not based on facts.
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I believe he was talking about all sexual immorality, not just homosexuals. What a fuss about nothing.
Certainly. The most often cited example of this is you're not protected if you yell "Fire!" in a crowded area when there is no fire, as you're causing a dangerous situation to arise from your words.
Another example would be when your words are a deliberate attempt to elicit harm or damage against another individual. For example, if you say "Go get him boys," or "I'm not saying you should do something about her, but something's not right with her," and action occurs against that person because of those words, you're not protected.
Another, and more relevant, example would be where your opinion is now in direct conflict with another contract you have made with a person. Because for all intents and purposes, democratic citizenship is a contract between the individual and the nation, with established rights being a part of the contract. However, say you have a contract with a person which requires you to endorse X product or Y activity, but you say off to the side that you think X product is stupid, or you go and make a stupid comment about something when you're the main representation of Y activity. Both of those activities are now violating a contract you have made with another entity. Because of this, while you are still allowed to express this opinion, it's well within legal jurisdiction for the entity to call the contract into question, as you are no longer fulfilling your end of the contract. The other side of the contract has the exact same rights you do, and they have every right to participate in only contracts that they deem fair and fulfilled.
The most important part of understanding the limits of free speech is that free speech is limited to that which does not infringe of the rights of others. If you say deliberately harmful speech, or even if you say something that turns out to be harmful, you are not protected because of an overarching blanket of "free speech". Because he's in a contract with A&E which requires him to be the face of the program "Duck Dynasty", he's bound by the contract to maintain or build a following of the program. If he says something out of the program which impacts his ability to maintain his side of the contract, A&E is protected under law to cancel the contract. A&E has a reasonable fear that by him saying something that elicited such a large backlash, he will no longer be able to fulfill his end of the contract, therefore A&E has every right to cancel the contract.
And it would be nice if you didn't instantly make the conclusion I'm some sort of dictator who wants the populace to be ruled with an iron fist, as you would probably not like me to make the assumption that you're an anarchist Bible-thumper who believes everything should be legal because God hasn't said anything explicit about it. Both are way far off either ends of the political spectrum, and both are incredibly stupid ways of governing, let alone effective ways. I only state that rights have limits, because individual rights are extended to everyone, not just one person.
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@Oracle: I just think persecution of heterosexuals has gone a bit far. There's similar cases where people have been fired from unrelated jobs for making "homophobic" comments on twitter. It's ridiculous.
He wouldn't have been suspended if he had said that he was ok with gays. No matter how you look at it, the station think his opinion is wrong and he has no right to have it.
Originally Posted by MintCat
the thread's title also bothers me. an opinion cannot be incorrect if it's not based on facts.
He wouldn't have been suspended if he had said that he was ok with gays. No matter how you look at it, the station think his opinion is wrong and he has no right to have it.
<Faint> the rules have been stated quite clearly 3 times now from high staff
Well, Phil Robertson is in a reality tv show and lives his life biblically, he sounds pretty fucking stupid. Actually too stupid to understand homosexuality and compassion for different people, it's not his fault if he's limited.
Plus TV makes people stupid, so TV shouldn't penalize people for being stupid, that's hypocritical.
and saying "I'm a good christian, I won't disrespect anyone because he's different [but they're all sinning freaks and they'll burn in hell]" Is, if you ask me, pretty fucking stupid.
That's pretty fucking stupid as well. I've never been persecuted because I'm heterosexual. People are NOT being persecuted for being heterosexual, they're being "persecuted" for being stupid intolerant loudmouth douchbags.
You almost sound like "Daym that's so hard to be a rich white heterosexual man in the occidental world"
If you could switch life with someone's from a minority, a girl, or a gay dude, you'll find out what persecution and harrasment are.
Edit :
That's just behond stupid.
Plus TV makes people stupid, so TV shouldn't penalize people for being stupid, that's hypocritical.
and saying "I'm a good christian, I won't disrespect anyone because he's different [but they're all sinning freaks and they'll burn in hell]" Is, if you ask me, pretty fucking stupid.
I just think persecution of heterosexuals has gone a bit far.
That's pretty fucking stupid as well. I've never been persecuted because I'm heterosexual. People are NOT being persecuted for being heterosexual, they're being "persecuted" for being stupid intolerant loudmouth douchbags.
You almost sound like "Daym that's so hard to be a rich white heterosexual man in the occidental world"
If you could switch life with someone's from a minority, a girl, or a gay dude, you'll find out what persecution and harrasment are.
Edit :
"Start with homosexual behavior and just morph out from there. Bestiality,[...]"
That's just behond stupid.
Last edited by deprav; Dec 31, 2013 at 08:27 PM.
I don't understand how without any corroboration I agree with Oracle so much.
You can get penalized for saying something. There is a company that writes these guys a paycheck to represent their image. When you pay someone, you're casting a vote. A vote that you approve of that person and their performance. It's not good practice to support people who represent your image if they're saying homophobic things during an interview. It's his right to say he doesn't approve of the life style, and it's their right to suspend him.
If I started using the n-word, I more than likely be fired from any job.
Just to be clear: they probably overreacted. A public apology and a fine paycut for that month would've been plenty.
You can get penalized for saying something. There is a company that writes these guys a paycheck to represent their image. When you pay someone, you're casting a vote. A vote that you approve of that person and their performance. It's not good practice to support people who represent your image if they're saying homophobic things during an interview. It's his right to say he doesn't approve of the life style, and it's their right to suspend him.
If I started using the n-word, I more than likely be fired from any job.
Just to be clear: they probably overreacted. A public apology and a fine paycut for that month would've been plenty.
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Creati0n says: still my favorite. <3
I sacrificed my firstborn for this great human being to join (M) ~R
Just Use Thunder!
Originally Posted by deprav
Well, Phil Robertson is in a reality tv show and lives his life biblically, he sounds pretty fucking stupid. Actually too stupid to understand homosexuality and compassion for different people, it's not his fault if he's limited.
Plus TV makes people stupid, so TV shouldn't penalize people for being stupid, that's hypocritical.
Good job insulting a large portion of the world.
Originally Posted by deprav
and saying "I'm a good christian, I won't disrespect anyone because he's different [but they're all sinning freaks and they'll burn in hell]" Is, if you ask me, pretty fucking stupid.
He never called them freaks... Christian doctrine states you should respect everyone, he's just following the doctrine. You shouldn't call someone stupid for that.
Who is more intolerant? The guy who says he doesn't agree with homosexuality but still shows respect, or the guy who calls people idiots for being Christian?
Originally Posted by deprav
That's pretty fucking stupid as well. I've never been persecuted because I'm heterosexual. People are NOT being persecuted for being heterosexual, they're being "persecuted" for being stupid intolerant loudmouth douchbags.
You almost sound like "Daym that's so hard to be a rich white heterosexual man in the occidental world"
If you could switch life with someone's from a minority, a girl, or a gay dude, you'll find out what persecution and harrasment are.
lol what. I like how you discriminate towards "rich white heterosexual men" then immediately say it's impossible.
Right here is an example of a guy who was suspended from his job for not being pro-homosexuality. Do you remember a time when being homosexual could get you kicked out of your job? Do you think a homosexual right now would get kicked out for saying "I personally don't like heterosexuality"? I'm guessing you are a self-pitying minority who attributes all their failures to injustice, that would explain why your world view is so fictional.
Originally Posted by deprav
That's just behond stupid.
Calling Christianity 'behond stupid' is a bit mean.
<Faint> the rules have been stated quite clearly 3 times now from high staff
